(no subject)

[icarus]

I have news.

Philosophy was not invented by the Greeks (600-400 B.C.). The word was. Philo (love of) + Sophia (wisdom) = Philosophy.

But not philosophy itself.

I realise this is a novel concept, even for some Ph.Ds. But yes indeedy, it's a big world out there. There were the 100 Schools of Thought of the later Zhou period in China (771-256 B.C.) which brought us Taoism, Legalism, Moism, Naturalism, and good old Confucianism (among others). While the Indian philosophical texts of the Rig-Veda date from 1,500 B.C.

Oh. You say that this is religion and not philosophy?

Okay. So the question "Propelled by what does a directed mind fall upon its object?" (quote from the Upanishads) is not a philosophical question?

So then, what is it that defines a subject as religious rather than philosophical if not the nature of the questions asked? If the texts in question discuss the idea of God or Gods, does that by nature make them religious -- because that rules out Nietsche, doesn't it? If the definition of "this is religion" means there are some assumptions that have to be taken on faith, then if there are hundreds of open-ended philosophical questions and two items that are taken as articles of faith -- do we dismiss all of the questions?

What does one do with a close-minded, Eurocentric, has never heard of the 100 Schools of Thought, defines-anything-that-smacks-of-religion as something that is anti-philosophical and stifles "freedom of thought" (because, as everyone knows, the actions of the Medieval-era Catholic defines all religion everywhere) Philosophy Professor? Particularly when your purpose in taking the class is to compare and contrast western philosophy with eastern philosophical tenets?

Why, one dumps his class. ASAP.

Rhetorical questions brought to you by one very frustrated Icarus.

Comments

[kenovay.livejournal.com]

*pets* Some teachers are stupid.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

He has his own views, and has selected an interpretation of philosophy to support them. *sigh*

Icarus

[kenovay.livejournal.com]

It pisses me off when people do that. You can't quite say "Hey, you're wrong, you idiot," because they're not, but at the same time they... are wrong.

That makes no sense. *shrugs* College has sapped my brain.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

Yeah, they're manipulating the data rather than stating something that's patently untrue. It's frustrating.

Icarus

[nostrademons.livejournal.com]

Well, sometimes philosophy departments will restrict themselves to Western philosophy simply as a way of keeping the subject focused enough to not exhaust their resources. There're a whole lot of different ideas that could be considered philosophy...discussing them all would mean you can't really study any of them in depth.

Amherst's philosophy department, for example, acknowledges that there's a long tradition of Eastern philosophy but then says that "We're not going to study any of that. There're good courses in the religion department if you're interested." This isn't a statement on the relative merits of different schools; it's just an acknowledgement that they do not have enough professors or time to offer courses on all possible schools of philosophy.

It's curious that he would consider religion (or Eastern philosophy) as something "anti-philosophical" though, because religion and philosophy have a long history of entanglement (science does too...natural philosophy anyone?) The first thing Descartes did with his newfound realization that he exists was use it to "prove" the existence of God. Sounds might religious there. I blame ignorance.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

Well, sometimes philosophy departments will restrict themselves to Western philosophy simply as a way of keeping the subject focused enough to not exhaust their resources.

I totally understand that and respect it. I truly didn't expect anything more than a simple nod, "eastern philosophy exists." But this man's presentation was littered with little snarky asides about the the reason philosophy existed was "because in Greece there was no one church to restrict freedom of thought" and he worked very hard to define philosophy as the foundation of science, and reason as opposed to faith.

From his presentation, one would infer that religion - all religion, in all contexts - was the opposite of philosophy.

He really loves his subject, and I think he's a good teacher, but we have very different views of religion and how it relates philosophy. We are not going to get along.

Icarus

[dphearson.livejournal.com]

I am...simply stunned. "We're not going to study any of that. There're good courses in the religion department if you're interested."

I went to relatively small, private Liberal Arts school, and Western, Eastern, and Islamic philosophical thought were studied in intergrated wholes- with a faculty of only 5 tenured and 2 visiting. Such a statement....*shakes head*

[mklutz]

>_> People are so arrogant -- religion and philosophy are almost the same things sometimes. And even cavemen had philosophy!

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

This is a very common, Eurocentric view that it was my understanding most Humanities teachers are changing, or at least adjusting a day of their curriculum to allow for something beyond the "White man only" worldview.

Icarus

[mklutz]

In highschool they teach you about how Europeans and Westerners built things like the printing press. In University they tell you the truth -- the asians did it /centuries/ before white people even had thought about it.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

Yeah. It's not a matter of superiority, or we'd have to say the white folks are superior to the American Indians because we had domesticated animals long before they did. There was good reason for that: they didn't have horses, cattle, or other animals that could be tamed.

I suspect that the reason why Asian culture had these things earlier is because of rice. Rice requires a very centralized team-effort to grow, therefore you developed cities and towns and governments very quickly. It's very stabilizing.

Philosophy also has such "ecosystems," and each one is different. One is not superior to another, just simply developed in different contexts.

Icarus

[leni-jess.livejournal.com]

I hope it's not to late in the semester to shop for a more suitable replacement course? How maddening to find your teacher so closed in (which might, as nostrademons said, be official policy/territorial) and closed off (which is a personal defect)!

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

That's my hope. At this point I'm ready to take a math (cringe, horror) class instead of this one. It was the first day of class, so hopefully I can switch.

Icarus

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

There is another philosophy teacher, and scanning his text it seems that he has a broader view. It touches on Walpole Rahula's discussion of Buddhism early on. The scope of the class is clearly up to the instructor.

Icarus

[dphearson.livejournal.com]

Breadth of a class, or school of thought, is certainly up tothe teacher- or to what the school will allow to be taught. If this man said such things in his classroom, that was his right, but to frame such discussion in pro/con religions shows a stunning lack of insight and thought.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

He wasn't obvious about it, and wouldn't get in trouble. He has simply neatly sliced off "religion" from his discussion of philosophy.

Given the class I actually wanted was Philosophy of Religion, this doesn't work for me.

Icarus

[dphearson.livejournal.com]

Many people who are Professors of Western Philosophy are woeful undereducated in the basics of their own field. For example, the biggest Philosophical influences that the greeks had- Pythagoras and Plato- came from men who had access to people who had studied with Middle Eastern teachers, who then in turn had access to India and the Chiness Nation -states.
Most recent graduates in Western Philosophy will not been even skilled with retoric or mathematics. Instead, they will show a smug sort of half assed liberal arts education- they can read the anicent Asian inflected Greek, after a fashion, and Latin, and golly, they were paying attention in their classes on Lacan.
Sigh.

Good on you, kiddo. But at least you get to see part of the reason why we as a culture suck royally.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

Personally, it's my observation that all cultures suck. I don't deify asian culture, or Tibetan culture -- I know them too well for that.

He's actually a logic instructor, and I have no qualms with his knowledge or ability to inspire. He knows his subject very well. But he hates religion, it's clear. He's the wrong teacher for me, because I want to use the western philosophy to apply it Buddhist philosophical thought.

Icarus

[ragnhildholm.livejournal.com]

bloody europhiles :-) see, my philosophy professor (from last fall) is far cooler. i saw her do a hand-stand yesterday :-D

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

During class?

Now I could go for a handstand-type professor. I'm going to go to a different class tonight, and hopefully she'll have a slightly different view.

Icarus

[ragnhildholm.livejournal.com]

Actually, no, it was in choir rehearsal (we both sing soprano in the same choir) - though perhaps a handstand would help your professor see things from a different perspective? :-)